Dazes/Mezzes = The mob cannot move or attack, but any damage (including previously applied bleeds!), or the application of certain debuffs (any tricks) or threat generating skills, will break the daze. Tend to be long (10-60s).
Stuns = The mob cannot move or attack. Damage will not break the stun. Tend to be short (2-10s). 10s stun immunity applied after every stun.
Knockdown = stun that can not be broken with potions
Roots = The mob cannot move, but can attack anyone within their max range. Tend to have only a chance to break on damage (10-50%ish), and last around the same length as dazes.
Fears = The mob will run around uncontrollably, and cannot attack. Tend to have only a chance to break on damage (10-50%ish), and last a moderate period of time. A mob that happens to run into a nearby un-aggroed mob may cause that mob to aggro (or a whole group of mobs if they are linked!).

Crowd Control Classes in LOTRO: Lore Master, Burglar or Hunter traited yellow

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Reviews

MistahHelpful left a four star re-review on iTunes:

“Re-review! In just a few episodes, this podcast has started to make the most of its giant array of hosts (seriously, I don’t know of any podcast with this many hosts). When things are clicking, the distinct viewpoints and humor of each host come through, and the time definitely seems more well spent. I love the new segments too.”

Featured Comments

Meramir left a comment on the Producer’s Letter article:

“Oh wauw, so only 5-6 years after releasing Legendary Items you add the kind of functionality people were expecting from day one. Good job.”

Tinybel left a comment on the Producer’s Letter article:

“Well i don’t think that will make everyone happy, but I am liking the no more level cap increase and the leveling Legendaries.”

Goblinsbane left a comment on the Producer’s Letter article:

“Well, without level cap rise, there is IMO no point to release Central Gondor (Pelargir) this year… What for region full of “empty” XP and gear that is not better then in previous region…

Beornings in Bree?? Lol it makes that class even more stupid idea then it was.

Only LI decision is good but it should be done from lvl 50, so it is still half baked solution introduced many years too late.

Huge dissapointment. Stupid decisions.

Don’t count on my money Turbine for a long time…”

Fredelas left a comment on the Producer’s Letter article:

“I’m concerned about potential the loss of flexibility in LIs by locking in their legacies.

If the developers make changes to class skills, traits, or the legacies themselves (which is happening a lot in this very update), we’ll be stuck with the legacies we have. If another legacy becomes more desirable, it sounds like we’ll have to start all over again just like we always have.”

Rabbitses Starkfoot also left a comment on the Producer’s Letter article:

“I wish they were raising the level cap. I think with the change to LI’s there really shouldnt be a problem with leveling up again in a few months since a lot of people were not looking forward to grinding new LI’s. Ah well. I’m excited to see how this plays out.”

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Final Thoughts

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15 comments

Kaleigh Starshine / July 21, 2014

Very nice show(s), everyone! 🙂

The discussion regarding how resources are allocated by Turbine and how we are in a situation of having to choose “this over that” was very interesting, I thought. This is always true, of course, but it seems that it is much more of an issue now than ever before.

With that in mind, even over Epic Battles and the Legendary Items system, I believe Turbine needs to show that the changes to the Skills/Traits system were worth the effort made. At this time, in my opinion, every reason given for the change has failed to come to pass or the situation has been made worse instead. Looking quickly…

The system was stagnant and we were not getting new skills

With the old system, each class would have 3 ‘improved skill’ with every expansion. ‘Improved’ may be a relative term, of course 🙂 But, by and large, those improvements were meaningful.

What do we have now?

At this point, we have earned 2 skill points from the level cap increase, and potentially 2 more from Epic Battles. Since there were already enough points to put toward everything in each specialization line, these extra points have to go toward the other lines with the double cost.

What this means is, if you have earned 99 points or less in Epic Battles, advancement to this point equates to increasing a single trait (almost always a passive trait) by a single rank. For me, as a Burglar, this is likely a +1% Melee Damage increase, which actually equates to a +.25% increase due to the Physical Mastery diminishing returns.

And…there is no more advancement coming anything soon, it would appear. The Dead Marshes update will likely be a very small one, and there are no level increases coming with Central Gondor.

Perhaps there will be some points tied to quests in Central Gondor, though tying points to quest packs outside an expansion might be a bit controversial. In any case, 1 single rank looks to be our skill advancement for well over a years’ time, two if you are a beast at Epic Battles like Draculetta *waves to Drac* 🙂

And, correct me if I am wrong, but I believe only a single new skill, for a single class, has been added to the system thus far, and only with this most recent update. There have been a few traits added and modified, of course, but that could also have been done with the old system as well.

Give me the 3 improved skills anyday!

Homogenization and Forcing/Defining Class Roles

Fervour Champions used to tank instances before the changes… and still do, along with most every other class now. A Champion and I (Burglar) did the Fellowship version of the new Epic Quest line with just the two of us.

Some still solo 3 person, 6 person, and even 12 person content. That last part never happened before, save for maybe Wardens.

But, at the same time, there is thread after thread of how some cannot even solo certain landscape quests and content.

The skill/trait tree changes have created enormous imbalances that, after 8 months, have yet to be fixed. And some of the attempts to fix them, like devaluing our Stats, have only created more problems.

This can be easily seen with the new Essences, where a Morale essence gives 875 Morale…

… and the same value Vitality essence gives 408 Morale and virtually nothing else.

A lot of our Meaningful Choices, another reason given for the change, are being made less meaningful or taken away.

I will stop now before this gets too long 🙂

We know players have left the game over this change. I know many personally who have. Any that were playing at the time of the change were playing under the old system, so that was not causing them to leave.

Have many new players come to these lands due to the new system?

I believe Turbine really needs to do some thinking about how to make the new skill/tree system worth the effort put into it, or we may all be asking what other systems/changes might have been made with those resources instead.

Reply
Lorghi / July 21, 2014

I just don’t get where the problem is when there is no more level-cap raise this year. Even if they add a new zone you still have: Reputation to raise, LI-Exp, Deeds. And beside that: Story Story Story. You can also enjoy the story without leveling up! And if there is no reason for anyone to play the game while you can’t level up then it is the wrong game! Do you really need a carrot on a fishing rod in front of you the whole time? And does it really always need to be leveling up?

Reply
- Andang / July 21, 2014
  
  I definitely am with you Lorghi but there are a lot of players who need that carrot to make the zone worth while. Even Merric and Goldenstar said they don’t do the filler zones between level cap increases so I think it really is important to a lot of players. It is not to me though but I think it is good for the game as a whole.
  
  Reply
- Barnabras / July 21, 2014
  
  I don’t do the filler zones at all. I’m a hardcore casual Lotro player. Meaning I don’t have much free time and what little I have I spend on LOTRO. The filler zones are way too grindy. I find most of the grind in LOTRO is not worth the reward, especially in the filler zones. And most of the filler zones are weak, story wise, in the LOTR books.
  
  Edanwaith is barley mentioned,
  Grand River, they pass thru in boats, not much goes on
  Wildermore is complete fiction
  Lothlorien is the only one that is, but I played that after f2p so it didn’t seem like filler to me.
  
  I would rather do the new content, raise level get some gear and head to the moors instead. But that’s the beauty of LOTRO, there are a million ways to play it.
  
  Reply
Amenhir / July 21, 2014

The content in u14 is not wowing me in the slightest. There weren’t even enough quests to get me to cap so it was off to soloing sword halls t2 a handful of times to get to 100. Why did I get to lvl 100, well that’s the latest cap and I need desperately to get there so I could unlock the latest grind. Grind, grind, grind, some more grind and in case I forget to mention…grind! The grinding is the nature of any mmo because it creates a false sense of value. Player A says “There really isn’t much to do anymore in this game” Player B responds “Well you can always finish up all your deeds, create an alt, do all the dailies.” This may seem like a lot of content but in reality it’s doing exactly what is intended…fooling people into thinking there is tons to do.

When I started playing Lotro over 3 years ago I was very excited to see the areas, explore a ton, meet new people, get to cap and do all those awesome raids I had seen people talking about in glff. Before u14 I spent most of my time standing around Bree using the game as a chatroom. This is not the experience for everyone I’m sure but I pay what i believe is good money for something akin to AOL.

Now we are in “Western” Gondor, which by all accounts is actually southern Gondor, but I wont split hairs here. After reaching cap and the end of quests I am hit in the face but a horrible grindfest. The grinding isn’t the worst part. No that is left to the RNG which is what every single deed, instance, quest, rep item, reward is tied to. What does this do? It makes people mindlessly log in day after day increasing log in numbers so Turbine can say to the big boss “Hey look our numbers are through the roof!” Until that is people get wise and stop bothering, ie Fangorn. For all their wishful thinking this type of content does not make me log in more but less.

Reply
- Braxwolf / July 22, 2014
  
  I’m confused as to why you play MMO’s, I guess.
  
  First you describe them, quite accurately, as a grind fest. Next, you log in and play. Then, you come back and complain about them being exactly what you already knew they were.
  
  I suppose I agree?
  
  Reply
  - Amenhir / July 22, 2014
    
    Lotro is the first mmo I have seriously invested time as well as money into playing. I had tried other mmos in the past and they never really did it for me. Lotro however, and I’m sure a large part of what attracts people to this game is the IP. I suppose at this point I am rather depressed at the state of the game. Grinding for gear and other various rewards is not the biggest evil. The true evil lies in the total randomness of most of the rewards. With that kind of randomness it gives little return on investment, mostly time. That being said I’m sure the response will be “If you don’t like it, stop playing it.” That kind of logic is exactly why consumers do not hold these companies to any kind of standard. I loved the game, I love the lore and for the most part I loved a lot of the content. However, that does not mean that I should just be happy with that is being presented. For example, the summer fest has started and this festivals steed is another palette swap horse in a blanket. If you aren’t going to invest the time and effort into designing something worth earning then leave it out entirely. I would like to see Lotro go out with a bang as opposed to a slow and painful death. I’m sorry that my “complaining” irked you as I was merely commenting on my viewpoint of the content for this update that you all seem to think is so epically fantastic. No offense intended.
  - Braxwolf / July 22, 2014
    
    I’m pretty hard to offend, was just trying to decipher the purpose of your post. I also find it interesting that you used to enjoy the game, and now you don’t, but the aspects that you say you don’t enjoy (grindiness, random drops) really hasn’t changed all that much in the meantime. Perhaps it’s what you enjoy that has changed.
    
    I am very careful to not tell people to quit playing the game. I hate to see people quit. Unfortunately, from a business perspective, losing customers is exactly how companies are held to a certain standard. The loss of money/market/revenue is the prime motivator for game developers – more than feedback or forums or podcasts. So, read my comments with a hint of intrigue. I like to try and understand others viewpoints when they differ from my own. I’m not mad, bro 🙂
    
    Feel free to disagree with us. I’m just trying to understand why.
Amenhir / July 22, 2014

Perhaps you are right. The grind being a necessary evil of the genre is one thing but when it becomes the basis of almost all new content is another. I guess I am one of those “raiders” that are so few and far between and well even though I got into the game for the lore, the end game was what kept me going and made the grind more bearable. I suppose I backed the wrong horse considering their “end game” hasn’t been that great since RoI and some people would argue it hasn’t been worth anything since MoM.

Reply
Rabbitses Starkfoot / July 23, 2014

I’m glad I’m not the only one who recognized some of the horrible music choices in Gondor. I’m getting the Farmers Faire Mushroom hunt song playing in towns that have been taken over by corsairs and people have been slaughtered. It’s super upbeat and completely out of place. Plus I’ve heard some Moria music in Blackroot Vale and some Angmar music in Edhellion. The Mushroom hunt music playing is worse than the Shire and Bree music playing in helm’s deep. They fixed that, maybe they’ll fix the Gondor music too. The new music is of course wonderful!

Reply
- Lilikate Buggins. / July 23, 2014
  
  The Gondorian music I heard was quite charming and very fitting! Maybe you have a special play list!
  
  Reply
Ike Illmore / July 26, 2014

Has this episode been put on iTunes, I can’t see it?

Reply
- Andang / July 26, 2014
  
  It has because I have listened to it. It takes longer if you don’t subscribe on iTunes.
  
  Reply
  - Ike Illmore / July 26, 2014
    
    I have subscribed to the “LOTRO players podcast” on iTunes but it didn’t appear there. I searched for “LOTRO players podcast” on the iTunes store and it was the first on the results list. I started playing it there and now it appears on my subscription list. Strange but all’s well that ends well. Thanks for your response and a great podcast.
Kazren / July 28, 2014

I just have to say I look forward to your show every week and you never disappoint. The chemistry is great; I love your humor. I appreciate all the information and especially the time you all spend on the podcast and the website. I know it takes you away from playing. Thank you very much.

Reply

LOTRO Players News Episode 56: Battle Lobsters vs Siege Turtles

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